She was then admitted to Penn on a full scholarship, where she identified as a first-generation low-income (FGLI) student despite her background due to her estrangement from her parents and lack of financial support from them, a classification she says Penn officials told her was acceptable in those circumstances. [22], In the New Yorker article, Fierceton and others criticized Penn for its use of not only her story but another recent FGLI Rhodes awardee as poverty porn, suggesting the university had turned on her when it learned she had actually come from a privileged, affluent background and thus did not fit the narrative of having grown up in foster care recounted in its news release and the accompanying Inquirer article. And now they have to face the fact that someone who looks like them, who shares all these identities with them, could be the source of all of this harm. And then I remembered that my teacher had told me to write a gratitude list. Or whatever our kind of contemporary version of it is. Period." Mackenzie Fierceton grew up poor, cycling through the rocky child welfare system. While that was not literally true, Penn's own definition of an FGLI student included those who have a "strained or limited" relationship with a parent who has graduated from college. [H]onestly, first-generation is never something I've really identified with fully. Or do you think that the wheels were already in motion before that? Well, Mackenzie, thank you so much for joining me and sharing your story. Not as something that is for the benefit of the MacKenzies, the people who were being brought into the school, but actually for the benefit of the university itself, its image and also for the students. How old were you when you were applying to college? Did they make that threat in writing or was that . [14], The publicity led 150 Penn students to stage a walkout from classes to demonstrate in support of Fierceton. [2], Morrison, no longer employed by St. Luke's, then began the process of trying to restore her reputation by having all references to it removed from the public record. Cause I had assumed it was her. And then the other question was: Are you the first in your family to attend college? And is it somewhat of a defense mechanism that people deploy to protect themselves? But the acclaim quickly devolved into acrimony as the university and the Rhodes Trust began questioning aspects of Fiercetons backstory. "[2], That feeling was not mutual, Fierceton came to suspect. Thats been my understanding of it. But I got a bit of pressure from Penn to do that. While her yes answer to "At any time since you turned age 13, were both your parents deceased, were you in foster care or were you a dependent or ward of the court?" I do think that it is a huge defense mechanism that people deploy. And its striking to see just the continuing to push of what happened. Penn filed a 130-page response two weeks later, denying all her allegations of wrongdoing and saying that the university officials and co-defendants who had investigated the case were unaware of the Driver lawsuit when they did. Im part of a wrongful death lawsuit that was filed in August, 2020. ", When Penn's Office of Student Conduct confronted Fierceton with the discrepancy between her statement on two of her applications that she ", The exact definition of FGLI relevant to forms Fierceton filled out is a key point in the Rhodes Trust and Penn investigations of her. And so the fact that shes continued pursuing you to me kind of demonstrates the entire case. A 24-year-old Rhodes Scholar has left the prestigious program after being accused of lying about growing up poor, reports say. But it doesnt mean you were always low-income, just that you are now. Did you go into foster care? So therefore that doesnt fit their understanding of low-income, despite the fact that your mother was no longer your legal guardian, youre a ward of the state. She feared that her mother had inflicted the injuries, perhaps out of jealousy that Lovelace was attracted to her, even as it seemed to Fierceton that Morrison was "offering [her] up to him on a silver platter". Our concern is instead with the conduct of our. MF: And its mentioned briefly. Not as something that is for the benefit of the MacKenzies, the people who were being brought into the school, but actually for the benefit of the university itself, its image and also for the students. What about Rhodes? woman who won a coveted scholarship in the US to study at Oxford after claiming she was poor, overcame childhood abuse and grew up in foster care lost the opportunity after it emerged she was. At the University of Pennsylvania, she received a bachelor's degree in political science and a master's degree in social work through a combined five-year program. Who will spend some significant amount of time in poverty. And I think its true. And I asked in the email exchange: Is this about the anonymous email? And at the time I was like: Why what? But that was definitely a driving force for why I decided, ultimately, to withdraw because I felt like: OK, federal prison is no joke. That evening that the article came out is when I got a call from the reporter saying: I got this anonymous email that said X, Y, Z, and I wanted to let you know. The situation was further complicated by a lack of cell phone service in the basement, requiring students to team up and verbally relay information from the 9-1-1 operator to a professor performing CPR on Driver and back to a student posted just outside the door. And I think said something along the lines of there were things missing and it was distorted. "[2], On her application, Fierceton recounted her background and the unexpected way it led to her becoming a foster child. The Inquirer story came out in November 2020. White, who had apparently drafted the offer, added a sentence to it requiring Fierceton to say she was agreeing to it "voluntarily and without pressure" after she learned that Fierceton was complaining to professors that she felt Penn was pressuring her to do this. But teachers noticed that Fierceton often seemed physically uncomfortable in her mother's presence, and a close friend noted that she was often injured. And so I did definitely have that kind of like: I have no idea what else is going to convince these people. Penn also noted that her name change had the effect, whether she had intended it or not, of making her background harder to research. Or is that it separates two into one? And I turned over all this information to his widow. And Im kind of one of the lucky ones where I had really expansive and thorough documentation for all the parts of this story. MF: So thats the background of him. By the end of the year she was in a third foster home. Am I right about that? And youre getting instruction from a university official that that's how you're supposed to fill it out, that's what the definition says online. [3], Before that happened, Fierceton withdrew from the scholarship on her own. Im curious, having dealt with so many people along the way, who are questioning your story, how do you feel like the boxes play into this? And whats the difference between the U.S. and English system? "[12] Gutmann, soon to step down from her position to serve as U.S. ambassador to Germany, had made increasing the amount of FGLI students at Penn a priority in her previous 17 years as the university's president. And you saw that playing out right away, right, when your biological mother was first arrested? I really appreciate it. She, about 10 years ago, she wrote a comment I think on a Gawker post or something like that that we ended up then re-publishing as an essay at The Huffington Post about, and it was about her life in poverty, and it went viral, millions of people read it, extremely well-written piece. [2], In July the OSC concluded its investigation with a 31-page report sent to provost Wendell Pritchett examining Fierceton's background more extensively than the Rhodes Trust had. as a kid. How much research has been done on the foster-care-to-prison-pipeline? And she was shocked. It quotes her as saying "If you find me dead, it was my mom. And we cant acknowledge that, so we then have to pick apart the other pieces of it, and say that well this, this just cant be real. And then it just launched into the first half being a line-by-line it felt like interrogation of my applications. That was my personal statement. Are we going to see these injuries? Youre welcome to talk to Penn Police or their Division of Special Services or the Womens Center, or any program that Ive been involved in, or people that have been involved in supporting me who can corroborate this. The nurse also reported bruises all over Fierceton's body, in different stages of healing, considered an indicator of possible physical abuse. Mackenzie is currently suing the university. And its funny, cause it just made me so frustrated and I actually went back and read it. RG: So one of the questions that you mentioned that they asked was about your essay , RG: which, correct me if Im wrong, but I think it begins saying something along the lines of: Youre in the hospital, you looked in the mirror, and you couldnt recognize yourself, you couldnt recognize your features. RG: Is that what sent you into a surreal state? Im part of a wrongful death lawsuit that was filed in August, 2020. Or is that it separates two into one? And then theres also foster siblings in the sense of other people who are in the foster care system who youre living with. Fine. One trigger for the beatings was sexual abuse by one of her mother's boyfriends, Henry Lovelace, Jr., a fitness trainer and multiple winner of the Missouri's Strongest Man competition in his weight class, which her mother warned her never to talk about. Mackenzie Fierceton (born Mackenzie Terrell on August 9, 1997; later Mackenzie Morrison, [1] : 63-64, 86 ) is an American activist and graduate student currently studying at Oxford University. This is derived from language in the federal Higher Education Act, which ties first-generation status to the educational attainment of the parent the student "regularly resides with and receives support from". What was the response from the readers of the paper? So you use what you have, uh, which are the definitions that were already out there. And Im like: I dont know what else I could give them that would possibly convince them if their belief is as a 15-year-old, 16-year-old was journaling about my experience of abuse and hiding it in an air vent, and it was actually secretly all a plan to like accuse my mother of abuse and go into foster care so I could have a sad story. And they released this quote-unquote report in April of 2021 with their findings. And you experienced that yourself, right? [2], To White, Morrison repeated her story that her daughter had fabricated the abuse allegations. I was like: Great. Is that what sent you into a surreal state? [2], Local police were called. Fierceton wished that she had been more willing to correct mistaken impressions that she might have made and at the time "just kind of crumbled behind the pressure. The teen said she was sent to. Like you said, theres also the cultural stereotype of like Orphan Annie and Oliver Twist of what these kinds of kids are supposed to look like that starts so early on in, and deep in the culture or media that we encounter that I think really ingrains that into people. And the theme of private school definitely came up many times over the course of the last year and a half. Fierceton had also brought her mentor, a staff member at the university's Civic House, into the meeting; at the outset Winkelstein told the woman she could not speak or she would be disconnected immediately. "[3][l], The Chronicle story led to nationwide coverage,[17][18] most of which framed the narrative as Penn and the Rhodes Trust had in their reports, depicting Fierceton as yet another exposed fraud. Thats not in question. "[2], When Fierceton returned to the St. Louis area on vacations and breaks, she stayed with friends. Her mother was a doctor and Fierceton attended a prep school, but she was. And the staff member saying like: I understand, can you please give Mackenzie an estimate of how many questions are left? And thats actually one of the things that, if there was any doubt whatsoever about this story, in some ways it was settled by that. Did she lie? But its relevant to financial aid and the student should check whatever box is going to give them most access to financial aid, which would be yes to both questions. RG: And did they say anything along those lines? There was, yes, disagreement, because I said there was blood in my hair in the essay, they said there wasnt enough blood or there wasnt blood or something. I mean, part of it is honestly like its looking at cause we just wanted to be as thorough as possible of when [laughs] I was crying, and then I was crying and taking breaths. RG: Right. They demanded that the university remove the notation from her file. But part of it is funding decisions. And its mentioned briefly. She recalled showing up at the foster home with her new clothes in a plastic bag, feeling "like a passenger in my own body", she recalled later. [2] The psychologist testified that she had seen both mother and daughter during 2007 and 2008. So I was like: OK, fine. on about your day, ask yourself: How likely is it that the story you just read would have been produced by a different news outlet if The Intercept hadnt done it? In other words, if you are parent who says that you are wishing your daughter well and youre telling the authorities that shes just mentally ill and its just a really, really sad and tragic case that shes making up all of these allegations of abuse and throwing herself down stairs, and beating herself up all for cries for help, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera you wouldnt then also pursue a multi-year long effort to destroy her life. Whereas white parents, a lot of times, it is much harder the bar is much higher to remove them from their homes because their whiteness or possibly class privilege or whatever identities that they have that might not fit a social worker or judges or whoevers involved perception of whose kids should be in the foster system. RG: who was, I believe now, the acting provost. [4] After gathering all the evidence, they approached Driver's widow, Roxanne Logan, who had not been informed of the accessibility issues and delays involved in her husband's death; in fact she had been given the impression he had been evacuated from the building almost as soon as he began experiencing symptoms. Mackenzie Fierceton, a graduate student at the University of Pennsylvania, has won the prestigious and extremely competitive Rhodes Scholarship, which will allow her to study at Oxford in November 2020. RG: And because you were not just low-income, actually no income, other than the jobs that you were working nobody has complained about the low-income one, right? "She was a foster child, but not for long enough. "Without her trauma, she didnt matter", wrote a commentator in the Tulane Hullabaloo. And so that was when it really transitioned, the second half of it, into these really intimate questions about my abuse until the point where I was sobbing and couldnt answer the questions anymore. But that was definitely a driving force for why I decided, ultimately, to withdraw because I felt like: OK, federal prison is no joke. Whereas a social worker comes into a poor home and looks around and sees just the normal poverty that our system has foisted on people and says: Oh, well, clearly this is somebody that needs to be stripped out of here. "[25], "I cannot avoid the sense that Mackenzie is being faulted for not having suffered enough", Norton told The New Yorker. The recurring sexual abuse by Lovelace had made Fierceton even more anxious over the summer after he gave her mother a gun as a gift (Morrison had called the police after Lovelace showed Fierceton pictures of the gun. In any event, The University of Oxford, where Mackenzies doing her Ph.D., has remained supportive, and in the wake of The New Yorker investigation, and the resulting protests from students and faculty, Penn lifted the hold on her degree. "[4][2], Winkelstein followed up with a letter to Elizabeth Kiss, the trust's CEO, alerting her that the university had been investigating Fierceton's story, found it to have seriously diverged from the reality of her life, with the abuse allegations quite possibly fabricated. And in the U.S., there is much more pressure to pull kids out of homes, right? Why would I do that? And please go and leave us a rating or a review it helps people find the show. And because you were not just low-income, actually no income, other than the jobs that you were working nobody has complained about the low-income one, right? If youd like to support our work, go to theintercept.com/give your donation, no matter what the amount, makes a real difference. I didnt really know what it was going to be, but I feel like its always good to have someone with you. But she says she occasionally received packages at her dorm room containing objects she suspected had come from her mother, such as a bracelet with an inscription about finding the truth, or others close to her, such as a pair of sneakers, which she believed Lovelace, who had sometimes helped her stretch before workouts, had sent. verbally. According to Fierceton, her mother pushed her down the stairs and then beat her extensively at the bottom. If youre an independent student, then you should check yes to both boxes. In 2020, former foster child Mackenzie Fierceton received a Rhodes Scholarship as a self-identified first generation, low income student at the University of Pennsylvania. Penn's admissions department thus automatically coded Fierceton as a first-generation student, a category it was seeking to increase among its undergraduate population, even though her mother had an advanced degree[2] and her grandfather was a college graduate who had taught at the University of Missouri. Why would I do that? That is when I would trace it back to. Mackenzies critics even began nitpicking how much blood was in her hair while she was in the intensive care unit. And I turned over all this information to his widow. Fierceton described herself as a first-generation college applicant who came from a low-income, foster-care background. After the trial ended with Morrison prevailing and the agency ordered to remove her name from the child-abuse registry, Fierceton resolved to change her last name. Mother and daughter both told the same stories they had earlier; Morrison depicted her daughter as "willful and intense", claiming she had bought and read many books to try to help her understand the issues she said Fierceton had. Are we going to see these injuries? There were so many there are, I guess I should say so many moving pieces. Fierceton responded that that showed the university's "vulnerability and desperation". At the end of the march they were addressed by Fierceton and other FGLI students. "[I]t was probably from someone in my biological family," she told The Intercept, "because it had photos of me; it had very specific information that very few people would haveand I don't think many people would have random childhood photos of me. And I didnt get an answer. RG: And so if its a well-educated white girl from a private school, thats way too close to home for a lot of these elites. RG: So, to cut into the interview here real quick, I wanted to add that Mackenzie is referring to a letter sent to the Rhodes Trust in December 2020. To me, it seems like any reader of the English language would read that in a literary sense , of its self-exploration, self-doubt, trauma. There was also the part of me that was terrified. [2], Brandt noted that Morrison never asked about, or expressed concern for, her daughter's well-being. There, she wandered the hallways until she found the history teacher, and collapsed. And if those things are true, and youre also struggling in poverty, then something is deeply wrong with the system. If you speak, Im going to disconnect you from the call. How much research has been done on the foster-care-to-prison-pipeline? While the investigators understood, they also wrote that the limited information she provided may have been more likely to elicit an answer favorable to her. I think there were almost 30 of those letters again, very similar to who had given statements in the past to corroborate my abuse as well as leaders in the FGLI community saying yes, we started this community. He explained that Morrison had had no prior criminal record, Fierceton's complaints about her mother's boyfriend and prescription drug abuse had been unsubstantiated, her cousin had witnessed no abuse while living with the Morrisons at a time prior to the incident, and he had learned that Fierceton "had regular temper tantrums, beyond the normal range for an adolescent". And still, it was just like: Nope. MF: So those questions really came later. Who are your biological family? I tried to help as much as I could. So, yes. And then as the different internships, and then I went to get my masters in social work and all of this happened, I started to see that continue in different capacities while I was in different roles, seeing that theme in this relationship between foster care and the criminal justice system. And that dynamic, I would say, [laughs] probably played a big part in all of this. And then the other question was: Are you the first in your family to attend college? I think they do have a richer experience if they have more diversity around them, but that is more the point. And theres also literature thats economic literature versus sociology, different fields have different perspectives on what that relationship between foster care and the criminal justice system is and what the causes are. So Rachel had it and Penn disputed it. What happened after you went out of the hospital? Our focus is not on the debate it reviews over Mackenzie Fierceton's accounts of her life, though we affirm her integrity. The 35-year-old has been hit with two warrants for his arrest. RG: I want to talk about where you think that pushback came from. I was a teenager and I was in the hospital and I didnt have any perspective. RG: And I just want to read this for people. Within a year of her arrest, another St. Louis-area hospital had granted her admitting privileges, and she was able to resume her medical career. [2][5] It did not disclose that it had done so until March. Like what does Penn say when you tell them: Hey, the Penn official who helped me fill this out said that these are the categories that I fit. And so can you talk a little bit about your research? "[2], Fierceton answered yes. Like, they want to curate a diverse experience for their well-off students, so that they can say that they had this diverse experience in college . And at the time I was more in panic mode than like, let me step back and look at this logically, theres absolutely no case, this is an intimidation tactic to try to silence me and sign this NDA and withdraw from the Rhodes and agree to whatever terms they wanted me to agree to you. And so where is your story now? Right. Mackenzie Fierceton described herself as s a "queer,. Fierceton grew up in a wealthy community and attended an elite private school in a St. Louis suburb. And that dynamic, I would say, [laughs] probably played a big part in all of this. And to me, I'm like I am a household of one, so I am the only person in my family. Jay Caspian Kang sounded similar themes in two different New York Times newsletters discussing Fierceton's story. Yes, definitely. And it felt very similar that, well, this cant be real. Like I just havent, really, there to be a lot of information about me publicly. You didnt grow up in crumbling projects your entire life. Yeah. It didnt have any facts of the case. I want to talk about where you think that pushback came from. This definition resembles the one used in the federal Higher Education Act, which says that first-generation status depends on the education level of a parent whom a student regularly resided with and received support from.. [3], After the interview White emailed Morrison about how it went; she wrote back regretting that Fierceton continued to tell the same story. There were some pretty basic errors, such as my name, my birth name, and my birth place, and claiming that I didnt have a sibling, that I wasnt low-income, a lot of facts that were pretty easily disputed. Cause then you cant think that it could be you. And, honestly, first-generation is never something Ive really identified with fully. And then I remembered that my teacher had told me to write a gratitude list. She had begun to remember more about the incident, and while still not certain how it had happened recalled that before it she and her mother had been fighting about Lovelace. I really appreciate it. Laura Flynn is our supervising producer. [2], "Family is not the people you are related to by blood," she wrote in the diary. And especially, again, like these stereotypes of black and brown, low-income families, the knee-jerk reaction is like: Oh, well, theyre unequipped to be a parent. Is that just an interpretation or did they say anything that suggested to you that the fact that you had gone to a private school and grown up in an upper-middle-class situation meant that you could never at any point consider yourself low-income? Interesting. In addition to the complaint she had made against Lovelace, a similar complaint to police that her mother was abusing prescription drugs also did not yield any evidence to support it. [2], Fierceton remained in the hospital, where DSS ordered her placed in protective custody. Later, another Whitfield parent Morrison had talked to told this woman that she believed Fierceton had done this to get admitted to an Ivy League college, an idea which she found preposterous. And she had gone to a private school growing up. My life is over, Im in the hospital, Im at rock bottom. 207 1,590 6,062 Show this thread Mackenzie Fierceton @MFierceton Aug 8 Will never not make my day to see this on the shelf. RG: Talk just a little bit about that case . They would not do so, however, if she agreed to withdraw from the scholarship, surrender the Latin honors that had accompanied her degree, and take a mandatory leave for "counseling and support" before receiving her master's. Thats the reality of it, but we dont want to think of it that way. Yes, to my lawyer who communicated it to me. Cause I had assumed it was her. Again, this is obviously secondhand, because I was unconscious. And then as the different internships, and then I went to get my masters in social work and all of this happened, I started to see that continue in different capacities while I was in different roles, seeing that theme in this relationship between foster care and the criminal justice system. [2], The fine was later withdrawn after it was found to conflict with a provision of the university's charter prohibiting the imposition of fines in cases involving academic integrity. And how much confidence do you have that that anonymous complainer was Carrie, your biological mother. Within days of the article being published, the universitys general counsel was in touch with Mackenzies mother. [2] She was also working two jobs, as a policy fellow with Philadelphia City Council and another interning in social work at Children's Hospital of Philadelphia. For all the readers could have known, there could have been a videotape of it happening. 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